THESE COMMENTS FROM SAN ANTONIO ARE PRETTY HARSH. They do not necessarily reflect the opinions of KSpace Contemporary (nor of myself!!).
A recent article in the San Antonio Express-News includes interesting comments from outsiders about Corpus and its issues.
Comments archived here:
laam119910:13 PM
Poor Corpus Christi. Last time I was there this summer it seemed so run down and old, especially downtown. No pedestrians, no new businesses, it's really got nothing going for it. Corpus has fallen so behind to other major Texas cities like San Antonio, Dallas, Austin, Houston and even the Rio Grande Valley. I think when Whataburger moved its Corporate Headquarters to San Antonio, it was the kiss of death for the CC economy. San Antonio welcomes visitors, new residents, and new business activity (Whataburger, MedTronic, Boeing, Nationwide, Health care & the U.S. Military, etc.) with arms wide open. San Antonio is also investing heavily in our city with new public parks & green spaces, museums, Airport expansion, public transportation, public transit, new educational opportunities, and the most public/private venture of River North/Pearl that will that transform the face downtown forever! That is why we are on our way to becoming the next great American city.
Ridley5:50 PM
The pro brass comments here sound very much like Brass/cibrian/councilman-icerayz owner chesney's astro turf group, Grow Corpus Christi, standard falsehoods. The author needs to do a little more then listen to Diane Metz who is a tool of these folks. Brass was trying to grab control of 29 acres without taking any responsibility for the coliseum which would be under a seperate contract with the city. read the full story at wethepeoplenews.com Brass was like a grifter who just spotted a desperate mark. Cibrian tried to rip off her own home town. Guess she was desperate after being run out of SA. Let's see if Brass is still a "player" in a year. There actions speak of someone who is desperate for cash.
EJ1235:05 PM
Hmmm...Ci
brian in a failed venture. They (Brass) should not have let her anywhere near Corpus if they wanted to get a vote.
robertaa_20003:26 PM
Gulf coast land development investments are a iffy prospect at best when you factor in the potential threat from hurricanes.
reg3732:15 PM
The economy will bounce back. Government spending created many jobs in the Great Depression, Hoover Dam for example. Some paint that as socialism, others as a wise public investment -- saw a cool site; Balkingpoints ; incredible satellite view of earth
norm1:45 PM
i own a home on padre island and they are continually reaising property taxes to the max to help make up for the lowly end of the town; so we have to subsidize the have/nots so it seems; this is their mentality for bringing in revenue for the city; just bleed the turnip; this 'city' is a joke
ccrider10:41 AM
Wait until the city has money to do something, former mayor Henry Garrett? Here we go again, politicians who are happy to spend our tax money. That was private money that was going to come here and help the downtown get going. We the taxpayers are paying right now because nothing is happening. And you want to tear it down for more parks Why? so it can look just as crummy as Cole Park, just a block away? Why is a prior mayor who didn't get anything done with the building even talking about this issue? you were voted out for a reason. take a hint.
ccrider10:25 AM
Corpus Christi is dying on the vine. The one thing that can save it is by having a developer come in and invest in the downtown. Yes that is done on public land all the time in other cities. It is not a land grab, get your head out of the 1800s. The city leases the land to the developer and can take it back at any time. This is done in dying cities all the time, the west end of Dallas, in Philadelphia, downtown Atlanta, etc etc. Corpus Christi is dying and the private land around the coliseum and the downtown has been sitting vacant for years. No one has come by yet because the private land is overpriced and the owners are happy to just sit and wait to get a return on their investment, whenever that time comes. Corpus Christi is dying, the population is getting smaller, and if you want to live in a backwards fishing village our doors are open to you. Hopefully something good can come out of this mess. Like the writer says, the people are mad. We are tired of the "not in my backyard" backwards thinkers running this town.
Dansktex10:05 AM
The comments are right here. Corpus Christi has been a loser as a city for the past half century. Most development there has been through government funded construction--the university, military bases, court houses, museums, etc. The downtown was abandoned not only by retail, but also by offices (which moved to The Bluff) and by the government (which moved to The Bluff and down to the ship channel) leaving a 3-block wide strip running for blocks with little potential for development since no one works, shops, or plays there. In terms of private development, the city constantly gets excited about new or expanded refineries that require 3000 construction workers for 3 years but then employ only 350 permanent workers afterwards. A protest group against property taxes being used for anything caused the city to stop doing anything that beautified the city (such as planting flowers in street medians). In 1970, Corpus Christi had only about 50,000 fewer citizens than Austin; today it is less than 1/2 the size of Austin. However, most of the development plans, including the Brass deal, have been wrong-headed and would not have helped. They have tended to continue to propagate the problems that have been occurring by moving into the water or into the public spaces along Shoreline Drive rather than developing the area behind Shoreline. The entertainment and marketplace developments proposed on land masses in the water would have likely failed due to the fact that the numbers of tourists and local people would have been too small to support them; they likely would have left the city with even more eyesores over time. The city made a mistake building the Coliseum in the public median between the two parts of Shoreline Drive. The Brass deal, or any other deal built around the Coliseum, would compound this original mistake, taking away public land and public views. The other side of the southbound lanes of Shoreline Drive is abandoned and available for development.
eternal219:38 AM
With Diane Cibrian as a "project partner" @ Brass, I don't blame CC's city council from turning down that proposal. A colloquialism about lying down with dogs and waking up with fleas comes to mind.
Matt9:26 AM
I live in Corpus. The four city council members who voted against the Brass Deal, did so before the negotiations were complete. Our city along with our lame duck mayor is a joke. San Antonio should be laughing at Corpus!
Milhouse9:05 AM
That poor old goat of a city needs to be put down. Why an interstate roadway was built into a town that prides itself of delapidated buildings & roadways is beyond me. There are politicos from the city & county who are stuck in the 70's way of thinking - hoping that someone else will come in a do the dirty work for them. It's no wonder that CC gets lumped into the same comparison of how people leave the border towns of Brownsville & Laredo to come up north to live like in SA or Austin. Way to go CC - wallow in your brown salty muck.
Will8:00 AM
Poor old can't-get-a-grip Corpus. The sleeping lady by the bay desperately needs her B12 shot(like yesterday!). My mom lives in Corpus and every time I drive down I'm in awe of what fantastic potential is being overlooked in this unique and sadly neglected city. They've let their beautiful old Courthouse rot away. The government of Spain gave them exquisite reproductions of Columbus "Nina" and "Pinta" sailing vessels - one was completely ignored in the harbor and got dry rot, the other had a barge break loose and destroy it. (Spain wanted them back.) A company was going to offer tourists and thousands of winter Texans overnight sailing on gleaming ferrys from Corpus to Veracruz - but no, seems the ship they lined up was too tall to actually sail under the harbor bridge (!). The Landry deal to shine up the sadly lacking T-Heads on the bay with a Santa Monica/Chicago Navy Pier/Kemah amusement area containing new restaurants, bars and a spectacular ferris wheel, etc. got quelled - might attract the 'wrong' types to downtown. The near half century long discussion of what to do with the old Lichtensteins Dept. Store has left a battered art deco jewel festering in downtown. (And let's face it - ALL of downtown Corpus looks like some apocalytic, nuked, end-of-the-world movie set.) Why artists haven't discovered this Gulf Coast paradise of cheap rents, sunshine and hundreds of miles of scenic beach is mystifying. (Could it possibly be since most young, bohemian artists tend not to be right-wing, conservative Republicans they're not exactly welcomed in dear old reactionary Corpus? Just asking.) Any city needs new blood, new energy and the buzz of progress to keep it humming. Corpus unfortunately continues to drift in some other-world backwater of political cronyism, a 'change is bad' mentality and apparently a civic boosterism motto of 'if it ain't broke yet we'll just let it deteriorate till it's completely useless.'
The Trash Heap7:00 AM
The problems began when, to eliminate competition with the American Bank Center, the city government closed the Memorial Coliseum, then neglected to maintain its exterior and protect its interior from vandalism while it decided what to do with it. Meanwhile, the ABC priced out of existence the smaller events held previously at the MC, and, even though the ABC charged to park in public lots, it has never finished a year in the black. Wanting to see the MC returned to its previous condition and public venues, rather than have the whole bayfront parkway developed into multistory buildings that'd block the city's famous Shoreline Drive, someone asked the city council last summer to put the war memorial plaque back on the building and restore it to its former glory, but the mayor wouldn't put it to a public vote, so there's now a petition underway to force a referendum. BTW, the SAE-N could never get a copy of the supposed contract requiring the closure of the gulf beaches to vehicles in order to move forward with the Padre Island resort. The CC voters who in 2006 shot down the privatization attempt generously not only protected beach access for its own beachgoers, but for the whole state. This month the state's voters returned the favor by approving a constitutional amendment upholding that access.
nepdcc5:23 AM
I live in Corpus Christi and many people are opposed to privatizing our bayfront to Brass or any other group that hopes to make a land grab of our public bayfront. Brass has an unrealistic proposal to build private condos and shops in a limited size property on the bayfront, which would take from the public. Brass is also wanting the city to pay for a high rise garage that would cost millions. There simply is no room for the proposed development. The resistance from citizens has been based on the unwillingness to give our beaches away to real estate people, who would then make us pay for things that are already ours. It's kind of like building a highway then placing tolls on it. We're already paying highway taxes, and we don't like paying twice. The best proposal for the bayfront is to make it a festival park and make the coliseum an open air pavilion which would provide much needed shade downtown. Small, local concessions would also be made available. Remaining space would be used for parking, as it is already.
Saturday, November 21, 2009
Wednesday, November 18, 2009
From the Caller-Times,11/18/09:
"The City Council took a step toward demolishing Memorial Coliseum but simultaneously will enter eight weeks of negotiations with the National Swim Center Corp. to redevelop the building into an Olympic swim center.
The compromise, approved 6-3 by the council, came after more than three hours of emotional debate in which some council members raised their voices at times and choked back tears. The council’s action Tuesday comes three weeks after it voted Oct. 27 to end negotiations with Brass Real Estate, the latest developer proposing reuse of the deteriorating building.
'If we don’t move forward now, future councils are still going to be dealing with this,' Councilman John Marez said. 'Do we want this issue resolved? Yes. This is what we believe is the best. ... If we go forward (with the swim center) and it doesn’t work, I have no problem saying, ‘Let’s demolish and move forward.’"
What do you think? Will either of these come to pass, and which is your preference? If they demolish it, what should be done there instead?
"The City Council took a step toward demolishing Memorial Coliseum but simultaneously will enter eight weeks of negotiations with the National Swim Center Corp. to redevelop the building into an Olympic swim center.
The compromise, approved 6-3 by the council, came after more than three hours of emotional debate in which some council members raised their voices at times and choked back tears. The council’s action Tuesday comes three weeks after it voted Oct. 27 to end negotiations with Brass Real Estate, the latest developer proposing reuse of the deteriorating building.
'If we don’t move forward now, future councils are still going to be dealing with this,' Councilman John Marez said. 'Do we want this issue resolved? Yes. This is what we believe is the best. ... If we go forward (with the swim center) and it doesn’t work, I have no problem saying, ‘Let’s demolish and move forward.’"
What do you think? Will either of these come to pass, and which is your preference? If they demolish it, what should be done there instead?
Good things are afoot
Grow! Corpus Christi is a Facebook group that is working on rallies and support. Join them! Join BoldFuture too! If you don't, you might be guilty of "keeping CC L.A.M.E." S
So which groups are you aware of that I should post here? What are they doing?
So which groups are you aware of that I should post here? What are they doing?
Be careful about those arenas!
In the news this week is that two well-known big-city sports arenas that have been recently abandoned--because their teams had to have a spike in interest and ticket sales that only a new building can generate--have been dealt with differently.
Exhibit A on top is the Pontiac Silverdome near Detroit, Michigan, built in 1975. It cost a rather whopping $55.7 million back then and was a state-of-the-art domed facility built in a suburban area...two fads that were all the rage in the white-flight era of 1975. (A dome, of course, did make sense for Detroit, what with all the cold and snow.) But when the Lions and Pistons decided they needed shiny new homes to spike attendance despite that the building was still a relevant facility, the Silverdome faced a bigger problem than most ex-stadiums: it was in a small suburban city far away from other venues. When that city, Pontiac, Mi., was hit by the recent economy as badly as anyone, the Silverdome was put up for auction without reserve. Yesterday it sold for a mere $583,000!
Exhibit B is Reunion Arena in Dallas, Tx. Reunion's problem was not its location, but rather its size and its hideousness; at 17,000 capacity it was not large enough to accommodate the NBA and NHL franchises it regularly hosted, and a new arena was initiated by the city of Dallas in 1998 and completed in 2001. Reunion opened in 1980 at a cost of $27 million; American Airlines Center opened in 2001 at a cost of $400 million. Today, November 18, 2009, the City of Dallas demolished Reunion Arena.
Food for thought. Beijing is trying to figure out what to with that whole Bird's Nest thing, too.
"We've elected you to get something done. Now do it!"
Another Caller-Times article, 11/9/09:
"Memorial Coliseum drew a crowd Monday night, despite being closed since 2004.
About 250 people mostly in green T-shirts with the name Grow! Corpus Christi gathered in the parking lot in a show of support for the aging structure, urging that the City Council revisit a development proposal it rejected two weeks ago.
“We’ve elected you to get something done. Now do it,” said computer consultant Blake Farenthold, setting off cheers from the crowd gathered before a stage.
Grow! Corpus Christi wants the council to resume negotiations with Brass Real Estate, the latest development company to propose a plan to reuse the building and land surrounding it. The city voted 4-3 Oct. 27 to end negotiations. “I think we were all really shocked,” said Grow! Corpus Christi founder Diane Metz. “But the great part is we mobilized.” The group formed on Facebook.com soon after the council vote and since has gained more than 3,500 members. Metz and other local business owners encouraged the community to attend Tuesday’s council meeting to share their concerns..."
This is great, and this is why I think Corpus has figured this out. I have been away for a few weeks, got really busy in Wichita, and now coming back to this I am seeing what's been going on in less of a day-to-day drama and more of a long view. As I read this I feel a different tone. I think that's because you all have not let it rest; the city is truly mobilized: petitions, op-eds, articles, Facebook groups, rallies...it's actually pretty impressive. I can say this in advance because I can tell that the pressure has become more outward, more public, and even louder than before--the response to another letdown was to ramp up the pressure rather than skulk away.
This time, at least, you're going to get it done. Congratulations in advance, Corpus. You have turned the angst into action, and it will be a great thing. And by the way, support your local newspaper. They have done an amazing job reporting on this.
"Memorial Coliseum drew a crowd Monday night, despite being closed since 2004.
About 250 people mostly in green T-shirts with the name Grow! Corpus Christi gathered in the parking lot in a show of support for the aging structure, urging that the City Council revisit a development proposal it rejected two weeks ago.
“We’ve elected you to get something done. Now do it,” said computer consultant Blake Farenthold, setting off cheers from the crowd gathered before a stage.
Grow! Corpus Christi wants the council to resume negotiations with Brass Real Estate, the latest development company to propose a plan to reuse the building and land surrounding it. The city voted 4-3 Oct. 27 to end negotiations. “I think we were all really shocked,” said Grow! Corpus Christi founder Diane Metz. “But the great part is we mobilized.” The group formed on Facebook.com soon after the council vote and since has gained more than 3,500 members. Metz and other local business owners encouraged the community to attend Tuesday’s council meeting to share their concerns..."
This is great, and this is why I think Corpus has figured this out. I have been away for a few weeks, got really busy in Wichita, and now coming back to this I am seeing what's been going on in less of a day-to-day drama and more of a long view. As I read this I feel a different tone. I think that's because you all have not let it rest; the city is truly mobilized: petitions, op-eds, articles, Facebook groups, rallies...it's actually pretty impressive. I can say this in advance because I can tell that the pressure has become more outward, more public, and even louder than before--the response to another letdown was to ramp up the pressure rather than skulk away.
This time, at least, you're going to get it done. Congratulations in advance, Corpus. You have turned the angst into action, and it will be a great thing. And by the way, support your local newspaper. They have done an amazing job reporting on this.
Archive: Caller comment board on downtown land owners in limbo over development inertia
From the Caller-Times, 11/7/09:
"Downtown property owners are sitting on 11 undeveloped acres and at least five vacant buildings behind Memorial Coliseum, hesitant to act until they know what the city will do with the aging landmark...Sentiment for saving the coliseum exists because it was dedicated in 1954 with its opening as a war memorial, it is considered architecturally significant and it is the site of milestone events in many local residents’ lives. Some neighboring property owners want it torn down.
...Dr. Jagmeet S. Soin co-owns 2 acres neighboring Wisznia’s Shoreline Boulevard property. He and Dr. Lee Guinn bought the land five years ago with intentions of developing it once a decision was made on the coliseum. “Our plans are totally stagnant and totally affected by the inaction of the City Council,” Soin said. 'For five years I have been waiting for the city to decide what to do with the coliseum. It’s truly unreal.' "
Jocko writes:
I don't blame these property owners at all! I would not do anything if I owned the Property! If they make Any Form of Improvement, the taxes go up! We STILL have a " Lame Duck" Council and I will not Vote for ANY MEMBER of the Current Council Again if they Do NOT Make a Decision and DO SOMETHING about this situation!!!! I think I can Safely say that I speak for a Great Number of Citizens that are Sick and Tired of Hearing the Excuses!!!!! JUST KNOCK IT DOWN!!!! Then you can Play around for ANOTHER 50 Years trying to Figure Out What you are going to do!!
November 9, 2009
10:39 a.m.
Catwomen writes:
ur best bet is to grab some popcorn and plan to watch a really long ordeal pan out. Because thats whats gunna happen as long as city council are the same people.
November 9, 2009
11:04 a.m.
hkarsh#290653 writes:
No wonder Dusty Durrill wants the Coliseum torn down. It is competition for his Concrete street property should it remain. Being the capitalist that he is he wouldn't want any additional competition particularly if he could get the city to pay to remove the competition for him. Then he just has to politic to keep anything form blocking the views form his property and he gt a double bonus.
November 9, 2009
11:35 a.m.
Ketzer writes:
Land Speculating Not Immediately Profitable! News at 11.
November 9, 2009
12:59 p.m.
50rider writes:
Just another excuse for landowners not to do anything with their property. These people have owned this property for years. They could have developed it long before the whole coliseum fiasco!
November 10, 2009
7:11 a.m.
ridley writes:
actually, it doesnt make sense to develop anything when the property between you and the water is in question. build a hotel, the city subidizes ten story one across the street. build out apartments, the city wants to let brass develop apartments across the street. the point is that anything build on city land would not pay property taxes on the land, brass in addition asked that they not pay property taxes on improvements, have hotel, motel and sales taxes returned, that the city build a parking garage (10 million) for it. that is exactly the reason no one will build while the coliseum is unresolved. they would be competing with their own tax dollars at a significant disadvantage.
"Downtown property owners are sitting on 11 undeveloped acres and at least five vacant buildings behind Memorial Coliseum, hesitant to act until they know what the city will do with the aging landmark...Sentiment for saving the coliseum exists because it was dedicated in 1954 with its opening as a war memorial, it is considered architecturally significant and it is the site of milestone events in many local residents’ lives. Some neighboring property owners want it torn down.
...Dr. Jagmeet S. Soin co-owns 2 acres neighboring Wisznia’s Shoreline Boulevard property. He and Dr. Lee Guinn bought the land five years ago with intentions of developing it once a decision was made on the coliseum. “Our plans are totally stagnant and totally affected by the inaction of the City Council,” Soin said. 'For five years I have been waiting for the city to decide what to do with the coliseum. It’s truly unreal.' "
Jocko writes:
I don't blame these property owners at all! I would not do anything if I owned the Property! If they make Any Form of Improvement, the taxes go up! We STILL have a " Lame Duck" Council and I will not Vote for ANY MEMBER of the Current Council Again if they Do NOT Make a Decision and DO SOMETHING about this situation!!!! I think I can Safely say that I speak for a Great Number of Citizens that are Sick and Tired of Hearing the Excuses!!!!! JUST KNOCK IT DOWN!!!! Then you can Play around for ANOTHER 50 Years trying to Figure Out What you are going to do!!
November 9, 2009
10:39 a.m.
Catwomen writes:
ur best bet is to grab some popcorn and plan to watch a really long ordeal pan out. Because thats whats gunna happen as long as city council are the same people.
November 9, 2009
11:04 a.m.
hkarsh#290653 writes:
No wonder Dusty Durrill wants the Coliseum torn down. It is competition for his Concrete street property should it remain. Being the capitalist that he is he wouldn't want any additional competition particularly if he could get the city to pay to remove the competition for him. Then he just has to politic to keep anything form blocking the views form his property and he gt a double bonus.
November 9, 2009
11:35 a.m.
Ketzer writes:
Land Speculating Not Immediately Profitable! News at 11.
November 9, 2009
12:59 p.m.
50rider writes:
Just another excuse for landowners not to do anything with their property. These people have owned this property for years. They could have developed it long before the whole coliseum fiasco!
November 10, 2009
7:11 a.m.
ridley writes:
actually, it doesnt make sense to develop anything when the property between you and the water is in question. build a hotel, the city subidizes ten story one across the street. build out apartments, the city wants to let brass develop apartments across the street. the point is that anything build on city land would not pay property taxes on the land, brass in addition asked that they not pay property taxes on improvements, have hotel, motel and sales taxes returned, that the city build a parking garage (10 million) for it. that is exactly the reason no one will build while the coliseum is unresolved. they would be competing with their own tax dollars at a significant disadvantage.
Archive: Caller comment board on the National Swim Center's re-emergence in Coliseum talks
From the Caller-Times, 11/2/09:
"The National Swimming Center Corp.’s plans for Memorial Coliseum are officially back on the table. Two other plans — one to reconsider a proposal dismissed last week and another to let the owner of a hockey team refurbish the building — aren’t off the table...City lawyers are evaluating whether the council can consider another offer, from IceRays majority owner Tim Lange, City Economic Development Director Irma Caballero said. After the council voted down Brass, Lange offered separately to refurbish and operate the coliseum.
...Whether Lange’s offer can be considered is unclear because he was a member of the Brass proposal team and his separate offer is outside the city’s bid process. The city can consider the swimming corporation because it was the runner-up in the bidding.
Adame said he would be surprised if the council entertained Lange’s proposal because it moves a tenant of the American Bank Center to the coliseum without added development. 'There’s no way I could support something like that,' he said."
BeverlysMom writes:
This plan is different from anything we've had. It doesn't clog up the Bayfront with a bunch of stuff and it's something people would actually come from elsewhere to use. A double plus.
November 2, 2009
10:19 p.m.
ivoidwarranties writes:
Go IceRays!
November 2, 2009
11:27 p.m.
rubine99 writes:
Oh yay a swimming pool! How exciting. This is something I can do every weekend with my family. Just tear the darn thing down already.
November 3, 2009
12:06 a.m.
d.clark#456008 writes:
The swimming corporation, an Austin-based nonprofit, has not yet built a swimming pool. It is in negotiations with Cape Coral, Fla., for a larger center.
Negotiations have gone on for four years. Please follow the attached link and see the double speak coming out of this company. Pay particular attention to this comment. "John McIlhargy, board member of the National Swim Center Corp. and director of project development for USA Swimming, said Thursday the NCAA was ready to host its combined championships in Cape Coral." Interestingly enough, this same group promised NorthSide (San Antonio)a minimum of five events. What exactly is coming to Corpus again? www.news-press.com/article/20091003/NEWS0101/910030360/1075
"Northside's proposal has been endorsed by the national governing body for the sport of swimming, USA Swimming, which has promised the venue a minimum of five events per year." This project has been in the works for two years. It goes for a vote in May and is funded by continuing an existing visitor tax. Why does anyone think that two "National" pools within 150 miles of each other would work. Why would anyone think that given the opportunity, a group would come to Corpus over San Antonio? More hotels, more flights, more restaurants and definitely more to do.
Corpus Christi already has a fee based aquatics center, there is no way that it can support two! Yes, they will charge a fee for use. They stated in a previous article that they would also be depending on fundraising to cover yearly overhead (Speedo, Toyota)in this economy i highly doubt it. I am guessing that they are throwing numerous irons in the fire and once the first one is ready they are going to pull the rest out. The powers that be need to really do some research before they are alllowed to even enter into any studies..BTW it cost coral $50,000 to enter into negotiations with them.
I do not see where this project is going to be a significant economic boon for the local economy. As badly as we all want something done, we cannot do this for the sake of doing something.
November 3, 2009
12:19 a.m.
AZ85138 writes:
Swimming Pool? Are you kidding me? This isn't going to generate money.
A hockey arena? good for the season but what about off season? 7 months of unemployment and not a money maker.
You need NEW HOUSING, FOOD CHAINS, A PARK, AND A MOVIE THEATER.
November 3, 2009
6:48 a.m.
penname writes:
The National Swimming Center Corporation has a viable proposal and is backed by a major company in Austin (Alexandrina Management.) It wants the bayfront location because it can partner with other Olympic aquatic events - sailing, open water swimming and beach volley ball. They would also develop the land behind the Coliseum, which is desirable. Take a look at their University Park $700 million development: http://universityparkaustin.com/categ...
November 3, 2009
7:07 a.m.
tartntaffy writes:
Come on already.... Make a decision... I used to have some respect for Corpus Christi City Council, but this has turned into a 3-ring circus.. much like Conneaut, OH..(a small town in our area)... We read their news each day to see who the idiot of the day is... and what asanine stunt have they pulled now.. Your handling of the Coliseum situation seems to be the same level of entertainment to the reading public..
November 3, 2009
7:37 a.m.
Riptide writes:
Round & round we go. We've been going round & round for a very long time. We need better city leaders. This Merry-go-round has got to stop.
November 3, 2009
9 a.m.
cctx361 writes:
are you f'n serious, these people want to make a swim center, this city council we have sucks they don't know what to do, bunch of old people wanting a swim center, stupid a$$ people we have controlling our city. we need attractions to attract people a swim center is not going to do that. just shows you how creative this so called city council is.
November 3, 2009
9:53 a.m.
Mom5 writes:
They need to make something for THE KIDS!!!!!!!!! Damn this pisses me off so bad. An ICE RINK?!?!?! Come on, you had it then you moved to ABC, so why the hell go BACK...o wait, this is CORPUS, can't make a DAMN STEP FORWARD!!!!!!!! There is a place in Austin, one of many, called Main Event. It has a bowling alley, laser tag, rock climbing and play area and it's freaking AWESOME. My kids have SO MUCH FUN WHEN THEY ARE IN AUSTIN. It's a shame we have to go so far to entertain our kids. Why don't they make something like that HERE! Geez, we have the beach, the freakin' natatorium, and the water park in Aransas. WE DON'T NEED ANOTHER WATER PARK OR SWIMMING POOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! There are so many other avenues they can take on this...I don't understand?!?!?!
November 3, 2009
10:29 a.m.
Trex_In_Corpus writes:
(This comment was removed by the site staff.)
November 3, 2009
12:06 p.m.
DrJackShepherd writes:
After two years of use, the city will realize that the swimming center didn't work out well. The city will be left with another financial mess...a swimming pool contained within one very ugly building. The downtown waterfront will remain...unvisited.
November 3, 2009
12:45 p.m.
HowdyDoody writes:
sad times bro, sad times
November 3, 2009
5:52 p.m.
FishFlats writes:
stupidest thing yet,ill go with Dr Shepard on this one,and i like Mark Scotts idea.kids park ?cant take care of the one we have now..and the city says we cant meet budget ?breaking news..dont spend it if you dont have it.
November 3, 2009
10:08 p.m.
HowdyDoody writes:
Swimmin' eh? I don't know what describes your MO the best corpitos - the American Crawl or the Backstroke.
November 4, 2009
9:28 a.m.
southtexasdog writes:
Let me repeat myself...Unless Leon Leob and family are on board, this will not work either...they will kill it like a cancer...Adame has failed his leadership test and wimped out... Oh Yeah what ever happened to Leon's promised bayfront proposal he used to kill the Landry deal and get a city manager fired??? You think the stink of that firing is not still out there? City Managers Association has a big black marker for city's like CC and only desperate managers will apply...nobody else will have-em. Thus you get failure after failure. And politicians like Adame sink us further when leadership oppurtunities arise and he turns tail and runs...only thing in the middle of the road in politics is yellow stripes and dead armadillos...case in point...Joe A. got run over by being in the middle!
Well KMA!!! Another bayfront deal gone down the tubes...lets see, I lose count..first there was the eighties landmass deal that would build retail shops, and restaurants on the Bayfront..shot down by the "aginners", then there was the 1/2 cent sales tax for economic developement that was shot down by the aginners, then there was the Landry Deal shot down by the Yacht club elitists...now the Brass deal...who killed that baby??? the Yacht club again? Joe Adame was my hope for LEADERSHIP and instead he "WIMPED OUT" at the first sling of mud at his reputation...get over it, your in politics Joe baby..and all is fair in politics...can't stand any heat then get out... But let some one lead for Christ's sake! or (Corpus Christi's) yep Henry learned that his old try and please everybody politics came back to bite his butt.
San Antonio has left us in the dust for years because of this "no leadership and who's in my pocket town mentality". Loser mentality for a loser town with no future because it was allowed to be squandered away by people with no vision, Luther Jones, Betty Turner, Mary Rhodes, Henry Garrett and now Adame is quickly showing no guts no glory.
A city with a beautiful bayfront and it cannot get it's act together...Take a look at what could be by looking at Seattles Bayfront and Pikes Market... And we have more miles of bayfront than Seattle.
November 4, 2009
3:29 p.m.
borntobewild writes:
Swimming pool? It's going to "sink" rather than"swim" as in "sink or swim."
The swimming pool idea will not reach the diverse needs and desires of our city. Will the chlorine kill the H1N1 germs? Boy, what a breeding ground for that.
And Scott's "lemonade" idea is sour in my opinion. What a waste of land to have it just sitting there.
I'm still in favor of the Brass project.
November 4, 2009
4:47 p.m.
CCTXCN writes:
This is a looser! Just like the ABC! Just pour the taxpayers money down the drain! The only reason it is being looked at is because the heat from doing nothing is heating up! We need venues to increase money comming into the city !
November 5, 2009
8:51 a.m.
Trex_In_Corpus writes:
I am willing to run for city council - why dont you give me a chance.
November 6, 2009
6:04 a.m.
Hecho writes:
in response to southtexasdog:
Let me repeat myself...Unless Leon Leob and family are on board, this will not work either...they will kill it like a cancer...Adame has failed his leadership test and wimped out... Oh Yeah what ever happened to Leon's promised bayfront proposal he used to kill the Landry deal and get a city manager fired??? You think the stink of that firing is not still out there? City Managers Association has a big black marker for city's like CC and only desperate managers will apply...nobody else will have-em. Thus you get failure after failure. And politicians like Adame sink us further when leadership oppurtunities arise and he turns tail and runs...only thing in the middle of the road in politics is yellow stripes and dead armadillos...case in point...Joe A. got run over by being in the middle!
Well KMA!!! Another bayfront deal gone down the tubes...lets see, I lose count..first there was the eighties landmass deal that would build retail shops, and restaurants on the Bayfront..shot down by the "aginners", then there was the 1/2 cent sales tax for economic developement that was shot down by the aginners, then there was the Landry Deal shot down by the Yacht club elitists...now the Brass deal...who killed that baby??? the Yacht club again? Joe Adame was my hope for LEADERSHIP and instead he "WIMPED OUT" at the first sling of mud at his reputation...get over it, your in politics Joe baby..and all is fair in politics...can't stand any heat then get out... But let some one lead for Christ's sake! or (Corpus Christi's) yep Henry learned that his old try and please everybody politics came back to bite his butt.
San Antonio has left us in the dust for years because of this "no leadership and who's in my pocket town mentality". Loser mentality for a loser town with no future because it was allowed to be squandered away by people with no vision, Luther Jones, Betty Turner, Mary Rhodes, Henry Garrett and now Adame is quickly showing no guts no glory.
A city with a beautiful bayfront and it cannot get it's act together...Take a look at what could be by looking at Seattles Bayfront and Pikes Market... And we have more miles of bayfront than Seattle.
Sorry to say that you are right. I hear that Priscilla Leal has turned into a flip flopper as well-she was gaining speed for holding strong to what she belives in. Mark Scott is to blame for this fiasco.
November 8, 2009
10:34 a.m.
cowboy writes:
I think our city leaders like to shoot down these big venues so they can raise our property taxes to make the city money. hell my taxes have gone up 400% in the last 6 yrs, keep shooting them down city council so that we all wind-up moving out cause we can't afford to live here!
"The National Swimming Center Corp.’s plans for Memorial Coliseum are officially back on the table. Two other plans — one to reconsider a proposal dismissed last week and another to let the owner of a hockey team refurbish the building — aren’t off the table...City lawyers are evaluating whether the council can consider another offer, from IceRays majority owner Tim Lange, City Economic Development Director Irma Caballero said. After the council voted down Brass, Lange offered separately to refurbish and operate the coliseum.
...Whether Lange’s offer can be considered is unclear because he was a member of the Brass proposal team and his separate offer is outside the city’s bid process. The city can consider the swimming corporation because it was the runner-up in the bidding.
Adame said he would be surprised if the council entertained Lange’s proposal because it moves a tenant of the American Bank Center to the coliseum without added development. 'There’s no way I could support something like that,' he said."
BeverlysMom writes:
This plan is different from anything we've had. It doesn't clog up the Bayfront with a bunch of stuff and it's something people would actually come from elsewhere to use. A double plus.
November 2, 2009
10:19 p.m.
ivoidwarranties writes:
Go IceRays!
November 2, 2009
11:27 p.m.
rubine99 writes:
Oh yay a swimming pool! How exciting. This is something I can do every weekend with my family.
November 3, 2009
12:06 a.m.
d.clark#456008 writes:
The swimming corporation, an Austin-based nonprofit, has not yet built a swimming pool. It is in negotiations with Cape Coral, Fla., for a larger center.
Negotiations have gone on for four years. Please follow the attached link and see the double speak coming out of this company. Pay particular attention to this comment. "John McIlhargy, board member of the National Swim Center Corp. and director of project development for USA Swimming, said Thursday the NCAA was ready to host its combined championships in Cape Coral." Interestingly enough, this same group promised NorthSide (San Antonio)a minimum of five events. What exactly is coming to Corpus again? www.news-press.com/article/20091003/NEWS0101/910030360/1075
"Northside's proposal has been endorsed by the national governing body for the sport of swimming, USA Swimming, which has promised the venue a minimum of five events per year." This project has been in the works for two years. It goes for a vote in May and is funded by continuing an existing visitor tax. Why does anyone think that two "National" pools within 150 miles of each other would work. Why would anyone think that given the opportunity, a group would come to Corpus over San Antonio? More hotels, more flights, more restaurants and definitely more to do.
Corpus Christi already has a fee based aquatics center, there is no way that it can support two! Yes, they will charge a fee for use. They stated in a previous article that they would also be depending on fundraising to cover yearly overhead (Speedo, Toyota)in this economy i highly doubt it. I am guessing that they are throwing numerous irons in the fire and once the first one is ready they are going to pull the rest out. The powers that be need to really do some research before they are alllowed to even enter into any studies..BTW it cost coral $50,000 to enter into negotiations with them.
I do not see where this project is going to be a significant economic boon for the local economy. As badly as we all want something done, we cannot do this for the sake of doing something.
November 3, 2009
12:19 a.m.
AZ85138 writes:
Swimming Pool? Are you kidding me? This isn't going to generate money.
A hockey arena? good for the season but what about off season? 7 months of unemployment and not a money maker.
You need NEW HOUSING, FOOD CHAINS, A PARK, AND A MOVIE THEATER.
November 3, 2009
6:48 a.m.
penname writes:
The National Swimming Center Corporation has a viable proposal and is backed by a major company in Austin (Alexandrina Management.) It wants the bayfront location because it can partner with other Olympic aquatic events - sailing, open water swimming and beach volley ball. They would also develop the land behind the Coliseum, which is desirable. Take a look at their University Park $700 million development: http://universityparkaustin.com/categ...
November 3, 2009
7:07 a.m.
tartntaffy writes:
Come on already.... Make a decision... I used to have some respect for Corpus Christi City Council, but this has turned into a 3-ring circus.. much like Conneaut, OH..(a small town in our area)... We read their news each day to see who the idiot of the day is... and what asanine stunt have they pulled now.. Your handling of the Coliseum situation seems to be the same level of entertainment to the reading public..
November 3, 2009
7:37 a.m.
Riptide writes:
Round & round we go. We've been going round & round for a very long time. We need better city leaders. This Merry-go-round has got to stop.
November 3, 2009
9 a.m.
cctx361 writes:
are you f'n serious, these people want to make a swim center, this city council we have sucks they don't know what to do, bunch of old people wanting a swim center, stupid a$$ people we have controlling our city. we need attractions to attract people a swim center is not going to do that. just shows you how creative this so called city council is.
November 3, 2009
9:53 a.m.
Mom5 writes:
They need to make something for THE KIDS!!!!!!!!! Damn this pisses me off so bad. An ICE RINK?!?!?! Come on, you had it then you moved to ABC, so why the hell go BACK...o wait, this is CORPUS, can't make a DAMN STEP FORWARD!!!!!!!! There is a place in Austin, one of many, called Main Event. It has a bowling alley, laser tag, rock climbing and play area and it's freaking AWESOME. My kids have SO MUCH FUN WHEN THEY ARE IN AUSTIN. It's a shame we have to go so far to entertain our kids. Why don't they make something like that HERE! Geez, we have the beach, the freakin' natatorium, and the water park in Aransas. WE DON'T NEED ANOTHER WATER PARK OR SWIMMING POOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! There are so many other avenues they can take on this...I don't understand?!?!?!
November 3, 2009
10:29 a.m.
Trex_In_Corpus writes:
(This comment was removed by the site staff.)
November 3, 2009
12:06 p.m.
DrJackShepherd writes:
After two years of use, the city will realize that the swimming center didn't work out well. The city will be left with another financial mess...a swimming pool contained within one very ugly building. The downtown waterfront will remain...unvisited.
November 3, 2009
12:45 p.m.
HowdyDoody writes:
sad times bro, sad times
November 3, 2009
5:52 p.m.
FishFlats writes:
stupidest thing yet,ill go with Dr Shepard on this one,and i like Mark Scotts idea.kids park ?cant take care of the one we have now..and the city says we cant meet budget ?breaking news..dont spend it if you dont have it.
November 3, 2009
10:08 p.m.
HowdyDoody writes:
Swimmin' eh? I don't know what describes your MO the best corpitos - the American Crawl or the Backstroke.
November 4, 2009
9:28 a.m.
southtexasdog writes:
Let me repeat myself...Unless Leon Leob and family are on board, this will not work either...they will kill it like a cancer...Adame has failed his leadership test and wimped out... Oh Yeah what ever happened to Leon's promised bayfront proposal he used to kill the Landry deal and get a city manager fired??? You think the stink of that firing is not still out there? City Managers Association has a big black marker for city's like CC and only desperate managers will apply...nobody else will have-em. Thus you get failure after failure. And politicians like Adame sink us further when leadership oppurtunities arise and he turns tail and runs...only thing in the middle of the road in politics is yellow stripes and dead armadillos...case in point...Joe A. got run over by being in the middle!
Well KMA!!! Another bayfront deal gone down the tubes...lets see, I lose count..first there was the eighties landmass deal that would build retail shops, and restaurants on the Bayfront..shot down by the "aginners", then there was the 1/2 cent sales tax for economic developement that was shot down by the aginners, then there was the Landry Deal shot down by the Yacht club elitists...now the Brass deal...who killed that baby??? the Yacht club again? Joe Adame was my hope for LEADERSHIP and instead he "WIMPED OUT" at the first sling of mud at his reputation...get over it, your in politics Joe baby..and all is fair in politics...can't stand any heat then get out... But let some one lead for Christ's sake! or (Corpus Christi's) yep Henry learned that his old try and please everybody politics came back to bite his butt.
San Antonio has left us in the dust for years because of this "no leadership and who's in my pocket town mentality". Loser mentality for a loser town with no future because it was allowed to be squandered away by people with no vision, Luther Jones, Betty Turner, Mary Rhodes, Henry Garrett and now Adame is quickly showing no guts no glory.
A city with a beautiful bayfront and it cannot get it's act together...Take a look at what could be by looking at Seattles Bayfront and Pikes Market... And we have more miles of bayfront than Seattle.
November 4, 2009
3:29 p.m.
borntobewild writes:
Swimming pool? It's going to "sink" rather than"swim" as in "sink or swim."
The swimming pool idea will not reach the diverse needs and desires of our city. Will the chlorine kill the H1N1 germs? Boy, what a breeding ground for that.
And Scott's "lemonade" idea is sour in my opinion. What a waste of land to have it just sitting there.
I'm still in favor of the Brass project.
November 4, 2009
4:47 p.m.
CCTXCN writes:
This is a looser! Just like the ABC! Just pour the taxpayers money down the drain! The only reason it is being looked at is because the heat from doing nothing is heating up! We need venues to increase money comming into the city !
November 5, 2009
8:51 a.m.
Trex_In_Corpus writes:
I am willing to run for city council - why dont you give me a chance.
November 6, 2009
6:04 a.m.
Hecho writes:
in response to southtexasdog:
Let me repeat myself...Unless Leon Leob and family are on board, this will not work either...they will kill it like a cancer...Adame has failed his leadership test and wimped out... Oh Yeah what ever happened to Leon's promised bayfront proposal he used to kill the Landry deal and get a city manager fired??? You think the stink of that firing is not still out there? City Managers Association has a big black marker for city's like CC and only desperate managers will apply...nobody else will have-em. Thus you get failure after failure. And politicians like Adame sink us further when leadership oppurtunities arise and he turns tail and runs...only thing in the middle of the road in politics is yellow stripes and dead armadillos...case in point...Joe A. got run over by being in the middle!
Well KMA!!! Another bayfront deal gone down the tubes...lets see, I lose count..first there was the eighties landmass deal that would build retail shops, and restaurants on the Bayfront..shot down by the "aginners", then there was the 1/2 cent sales tax for economic developement that was shot down by the aginners, then there was the Landry Deal shot down by the Yacht club elitists...now the Brass deal...who killed that baby??? the Yacht club again? Joe Adame was my hope for LEADERSHIP and instead he "WIMPED OUT" at the first sling of mud at his reputation...get over it, your in politics Joe baby..and all is fair in politics...can't stand any heat then get out... But let some one lead for Christ's sake! or (Corpus Christi's) yep Henry learned that his old try and please everybody politics came back to bite his butt.
San Antonio has left us in the dust for years because of this "no leadership and who's in my pocket town mentality". Loser mentality for a loser town with no future because it was allowed to be squandered away by people with no vision, Luther Jones, Betty Turner, Mary Rhodes, Henry Garrett and now Adame is quickly showing no guts no glory.
A city with a beautiful bayfront and it cannot get it's act together...Take a look at what could be by looking at Seattles Bayfront and Pikes Market... And we have more miles of bayfront than Seattle.
Sorry to say that you are right. I hear that Priscilla Leal has turned into a flip flopper as well-she was gaining speed for holding strong to what she belives in. Mark Scott is to blame for this fiasco.
November 8, 2009
10:34 a.m.
cowboy writes:
I think our city leaders like to shoot down these big venues so they can raise our property taxes to make the city money. hell my taxes have gone up 400% in the last 6 yrs, keep shooting them down city council so that we all wind-up moving out cause we can't afford to live here!
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